Hero Discussion: Faceless Void

Continuing this from the past discussions! Today's topic is Faceless Void, Voidasaurus Rex, Faceless Rex, and the ever-pervasive Faceful Void.

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You've been visited by FACEFULL VOID
Repost within 5 minutes or bad luck and memes

Share your builds, your thoughts, your wishes for the Hero, ideas on how he can be used - and generally, everything big purply timey wimey.

Me, I'm convinced everyone's building him wrong. They pick him, go 'YEAH VOID HARDEST CARRY DTOA TOO' and then proceed to build a Mask of Madness :/

A more realistic approach would be to take a look at what all the other hard carries provide. Namely... lategame utility. Well, you've got Ultbox, but that's on a 100 second cooldown and hard carries don't get Aghanim's Scepter.

Oh, whoops - my bad. Most hard carries don't get Aghanim's Scepter. Anyway, you have huge downtime, so let's try and rectify that over Mask of Badness.

Instead, I propose a newerino builderino, which goes as such:
Quelling Blade
Boots of Speed
Yasha
Boots of Travel
Manta Style

From then, build up stat and illusion items. Fight with your ult, split push while it's down. It's far more active than 'fight with ult, feed when it ends cause you bought MoM on a 1.6 Str per level Hero, and if you live go farm the jungle till it's up again'. 6-slots may look like:

Boots of Travel
Manta Style
Butterfly
Eye of Skadi

Situationals: Daedalus, Monkey King Bar, Mjollnir, Black King Bar, Satanic, Diffusal Blade.

What's a game without rat?

I have seen a hard carry build. You rush maelstrom to farm.
Secondly, you do build aghs on void. hes that good of a carry with a 60 second chrono. He gets complemented with damage from outside I think aghs on carry void is plausible.

You get only one point in backtrack. Simply because of psychological reasons. I see people praying to RNGesus that they backtrack, and even we, who know better, rely on it rather than thinking it as a bonus that we should not rely on.
So aghs gives him a considerable fight power.
You can choose to upgrade your maelstrom to mjollnir, or start fighting and progress to a bkb and butterfly.

End game items are your Assault cuirass/satanic and Daedalus. Sell your maelstrom for a refresher/mkb and eat that moon shard.

MoM Void is the one you pick up as offlaner or if game is just going really poorly and you need to fight immediately. I'm glad we both notice that if Void gets MoM, he tends to die, and if he's dying, he's not really a hard carry, just a semi-carry. However, get a build that keeps him alive and able to do stuff outside of chrono, and you have the Don of Hard Carries, only opposed by Dusa, Spectre, Morph, and a CK that somehow got 6 slotted.

My way of playing Void is quite a bit like yours, with Manta as its main item, usually Midas to speed up my farm, and a helm of the dominator for sustain, and to make into a Satanic so Void can actually be tanky late game. After Manta, a diffusal, I tend to pick up for another dispel and for annoying mana burn and massive AGI, and then butterfly. I actually avoid BKB on Void, since his damage is not naturally high like PA or Troll and much of the game, you need only dispels for splitpushing that you'll likely do on the side, and if I'm in a game where the dispels won't do the job, I shouldn't be using Void anyway.

An alternative hard carry build is one that uses Battle Fury and items like Moon Shard, as Void benefits quite a bit from a higher farm rate from those items.

And... what's the point of this build? You farm like a snail, you can't manfight or kill heroes in Chrono because you wasted 5k gold on completely, and I emphasize that, completely useless item aka Manta Style. How is this Void a hardcarry? He still has 1.6 str until you get Eye of Skadi, and he will get it really late because he can't farm effectively and can't kill stuff in Chrono. He is hardly less useless without Chrono than a standard Void.

You can build Eye of Skadi- Butterfly- Manta Style on any agility hero, but that doesn't mean you should. Tera pls don't try to find yourself a new Terrorblade.

Also I'm tired of people claiming Void can't do much without his ultimate. Makes me think they have never played against at least semi-decent Void.

The advantage of Manta over Maelstrom is that illusions are the best-scaling steroid in Dota, and have the added benefit of awesome split-pushing. And if you're going as the #1, Aghs is still a terrible item because it gives awful stats. I'd rather a Skadi, thanks. AC I also disagree with, as Void's an Agility hero with decent stat gain. Armour isn't his problem, especially if going for a stats and illusion build, which leaves the -armour and attack speed. At the time you get AC, -5 armour isn't a lot, and there are better items for attack speed.



Actually, your farming isn't low because Midas is very legit on Void at all times, and even without it Yasha BoTs is efficient and effective for farming. Also, Manta is beast. +66% base damage as a steroid in a build that focuses on Agility? With some splitpush? Seems pretty damn good to me. Not to mention that crits is an awesome item on Void, which illusions work well with.

And while Void can do things without his ultimate, he's kinda squishy and prone to kiting, both of which Manta and Skadi rectify.

ohhhh
60 second cooldown on a game breaking ultimate: no.

Let me farm for 35 mins while my base breaks, to get a skadi.




This looks like a sad naga siren story.

Tera pls

Terapls: his aghs is as good as tiny's scepter

You didn't even mention Midas anywhere in the OP to begin with. Anyway, Mom-Mael is worth only, like, 500 gold more than Midas- Yasha, gives more farming speed and actually lets you do something inside your ultimate.

Yep, Manta is great... except illusions do no damage in Chrono before 5-6 slots and are useless 350 MS melee creeps outside of it. 66% base damage is nothing because Void's base damage sucks in the first place. Here's an easy experiment:

Go to a lobby, get to a level you usually were when you got Manta Style(can I see matches with your Manta Void on Dotabuff btw?), summon Pudge and give him HoT(maybe 2) and a Chainmail or Platemail. Cast Chrono, beat him up alone, check how much HP left, wait till he regenerates, cast Chrono again, send your illusions to beat him instead of yourself this time, check Hp again. 66%? I doubt they will score at least 50. If you want to build a Terrorface Voidblade, at least get Manta Style as a last slot when it will actually boost your damage output.

Tell me how is Void with MoM, BKB and Mjollnir(same networth as Skadi and Manta) is prone to kiting while Skadi-Manta Void is not.

Replacing Mask of Madness slows down your early Farm drastically, not to mention you can no longer Jungle as you lack any sort of Regen. Void is incredibly Squishy, even without Mask of Madness activated, but while Chrono is down, you want to spend most of your time Farming anyway. I fail to see how Yasha makes any improvement to Void's ability to Split-Push compared to MoM.

MoM into Yasha? Sounds good if your aim is to Farm aggressively, similarly to a Juggernaut. Push out a Lane, rotate into the Jungle, and generally Farm near enemy Towers, preparing to Ult if they come for you, or take a Tower if they 4 or 5-man elsewhere.

As for the 66%, Void scales far better with raw Attack Speed than Agility. Remember, this guy can 1 vs 1 over 90% of the Hero Pool in the Late Game due to Time Lock. It is your damage steroid and scales better with Mask of Madness, Mjollnir and Moon Shard than any other Items. You don't get a Daedalus on Void because it's good on Void, you actually get Daedalus on Void because Daedalus also scales incredibly well with Attack Speed.

Finally, with the Ratting idea, there's no reason to turn Void into a Rat Hero, he already does well in manfighting and picking off Split-Pushers. He should not buy Radiance, he does not have Moon Glaives, Metamorphosis or Mana Break, his Illusions do not gain any of his abilities, his Illusions aren't even remotely useful at Ratting. If you want to build Manta on him, you should only do it for the Purge, i.e. against Overgrowth, Global Silence, etc.

Yeah you kinda need to build MoM. It's the most cost efficient farming item in the game, and Void is a hero that absolutely needs the ability to flash farm. It's also the best way for Void to solo kill. If you don't have MoM, getting solo kills when you can afford to use Chrono on one hero. No other early game item allows that.

I actually think Void is a pretty bad hard carry now, and is much better as a snowball carry. Like the issue is, his ideal 6 slot has two none DPS items in it. You absolutely want Refresher Orb, and you don't have the mana pool to do so unless you build like Ag's. Maybe Skadi is a decent alternative, but Ag's is a little better I feel.

Then there will be a lot of games where you need to get a BKB, and you've gotta have bots, so really you are only left with two late game slots purely for damage. Now Refresher can be put on a courier, so I guess you have 3, but that's not exactly enough, and it leaves you fragile for a late game hero.

So really the hero either needs to snowball, or he needs to have a team that can synergise with him to help him. I also think he needs a second damage dealing core to pick up his slack, since unless he snowballs he has a really weak mid-game.

In essence, I think he just got a little over-nerfed. Just a little.

Stop bashing the op on not building a MoM.
His whole idea is to NOT BUILD MoM.
Read the post ppl.


Tera, not every hero has the synergistic qualities that can make manta viable. I think we all agree here that manta is a kind of early late/ mid game item?

Whats more,if you go manta, you went the semi carry way(necro void in the spirit). Also, given the mana cost increase to chrono, i dont think void can take that 165 mana increase effectively to utilize illusions.

Further, hisillusions dont bash, dont backtrack and have no steroid of their own. YOu can go diffusal but do you really want to? I mean thats not playing to the hero's characterstics.

My suggestion here, would be to go full Attack speed void.
Mjollnir butterfly,ac, eaten moon shard, Moon shard in slot, boots and MKB/BKB.
Try this in a lobby and tell me how many times did you permabashed a poor soul.