My Techies rework ideas

Well they ARE a lot weaker, not just on paper.

Current Techies : You step on mines, you're instantly dead.

New Techies : You step on mines, you get hit by annoying effects that you can easily make out from.

Essentially the new Techies is countered by sentries/gem/necrobook just as well but he's now *also* countered by BKB and TP scrolls. And Techies can't be where his mines are all the time to even if the hero himself can cancel TP's it won't change anything.

Look at it this way : the current Techies instakills you when you walk on his mines, and the current Techies is still the weakest hero in dota right now. You need to make him *stronger* and you can't go any stronger than instakill.

The only way to make Techies stronger is to buff his cooldowns so he doesn't spend 2 minutes setting up his mines every time.

With skills this weak I'd buff the cooldowns to 2-3 seconds so he can fill huge areas with them. And give him a decent ult. And even then I think he's still horribly weak.

This is the big problem I have with the current techies setup - insta-kills are so strong that they've had to nerf the **** out of everything else to compensate. ****py teamfight, ****py mobility, no lane presence, vulnerable as hell.

New techies - no insta-kills but much better teamfight, stronger laning, better survivability/mobility, interfaces a lot more with allies, not countered as strongly by gem/necro. (since only 2 of your skills are mine based instead of 3). Basically reduce his weaknesses and also reduce his main strength somewhat.

Like I said, all these skills are open for discussion on the details...everything is on the table including stat changes and extra effects. I don't think you need to spend a minute or more planting mines in the same spot now. I'd quite happily reduce that level 1 CD - but do think 2-3 seconds late game means it's almost impossible to push without backdooring.

Maybe there could be some kind of "charge" system like on the Spirits - you have/regen X number of mine plants per minute, so you can plant several in a burst, but then need to wait, etc.

Normally you're the greatest Sando, but I'm not sure I agree with you here. You've taken everything that it means to be Techies - instakills, intimidation, anti-push - and taken it away. I think the only usefulness for any of the changes you've made is teamfighting, but Techies is not a teamfight hero. He is SUPPOSED to rat and psych out the enemy. When he's right there in the fight laying mines, he's not so scary and you can hard focus and kill him. I just don't see the point in changing him in the way you have.

Techies is a troll hero, he isn't imba or anything just REALLY annoying.
No need to change him.

Techies is techies. They shouldn't be adapted into the hero pool. Techies is just different and I really hope Valve will come up with some unique hero ideas like Techies that will change the game completely.

On a side note Rubik stealing mines is so much fun.

Updated - lets break the mould a little more...

Basics:

Movespeed: 295
Damage: 38-42
Strength: 22 + 2.2 per level
Agility: 14 + 1.5 per level
Intelligence: 22 + 2.9 per level
Armour: 6

Napalm Mines:

Techies plant a mine containing napalm, a sticky fire that burns heroes and reduces their turn rate.

Damage Type: Magical
Initial Damage: 20/30/40/50
Burn Damage Per Second: 40/55/70/90
Turn Rate Slow: 50%/50%/50%/50%
Burn Duration: 5/6/7/8
AOE: 450
AOE Duration: 4/5/6/7
Mana Cost: 100/120/140/160
CD: 10/8/6/4

* Destroys trees in the area effected. Only 1 instance of napalm damage can effect an enemy at a time. Going into another area of napalm will refresh the burn duration.

When triggered, any enemy unit in the AOE will be hit for the initial damage, and will then suffer burn damage for the duration time, even if they leave the area immediately. The duration is reset for every second the enemy unit is in the area, and will only begin to countdown when they are not in an area effected by napalm. When napalm mines are triggered, your team gains vision of the area effected for the AOE duration.

Toxic Mines:

Techies plant a mine full of noxious smoke and toxins that slows and silences enemy units.

Movement Slow: 30%/35%/40%/45%
Attack Miss Chance: 30%/35%/40%/45%
Effect Duration: 43/4.5/5/5.5
AOE: 300/330/360/390
Mana Cost: 80/100/120/140
CD: 12/10/8/6

* Any enemy units effected are silenced and invisible units revealed while in the AOE. When toxic mines are triggered, your team gains vision of the area effected for the AOE duration.

Effect lingers for 1 second after leaving the AOE.

Rocket Jump:

Firing at their own feet with their rocket launcher, the techies propel themselves through the air. Damages both themselves and nearby enemy units at both the start and end points.

Leap range: 400/500/600/700
Damage: 75/125/175/225 (Physical)
Damage AOE: 200
Mana Cost: 70/80/90/100
CD: 25/22/19/16

* Can be used to pass terrain such as cliffs, disjoint projectiles. Rocket jump will propel Techies forward in the direction they are currently facing. Mini-stuns on impact.

Light the Fuse:

Attempting to trigger their entire munitions supply in one go, the Techies make a suicidal attack on the enemy team. When the ability is activated, a 5 second countdown is started and a noise played similiar to Alchemist's concotion.

Damage: 500/700/900 (Pure)
Stun: 1.5/2/2.5 (Pierces spell immunity)
AOE: 400/500/600 (centered around techies)
Mana Cost: 50/100/150
Cooldown: 120/100/80

Damage is applied to Techies themselves (can be used to deny), and all enemy units in the AOE. If Techies are killed before the countdown expires, it will continue and still blow up in their corpse location. Cannot be silenced, purged or stopped in any way once activated. Techies cannot protect themselves from the damage using Eul's/Ghost Scepter etc.

Mine Charges:

Techies collects mine charges that he requires in order to be able to use them. He starts with 1, and has a maximum of 8. They recharge at the rate of 10 seconds + 2 seconds per existing mine. Note, you can have more than this many mines, but you use one charge per placement. Casting speed and placement range is considerably improved vs current.

Thinking:

I want Techies to become more of an ambush ganker, with utility "spotting"/"harassment" mines places around the map. He can rapidly place multiple mines if he has charges available, making him able to setup more quickly, and be more effective in team fights. He hangs around in areas he's mined, waiting to ambush heroes who wander unsuspectingly into his mines.

Better?

Rocket jump imo ahould just be used as an escape skill.

OR.

What techies lacked is mobility. Reduce cd naow.

Also: me no like ulti

Guys, Techies may just be needing a buff to their cooldowns, but I don't think we should dismiss Sando's idea like this. His hatred for techies may be what prompted him to attempt a hero rework in the first place, but why should we put him down? We should use this to explore what techies could have been: more mobile, mines covering a larger area, but less damage overall.


Ok, back to my suggestions. After a night of sleep, I came up with a few ideas you could implement. Firstly, Napalm should go through spell immunity but still be magic damage, and the mine is still triggered when destroyed. This means that it will be time-consuming for enemies to de-mine, because they'd have to wait for the napalm to dissipate each time they de-mine at a chokepoint. Necrobook Warriors will die after running through a few mines, making it ineffective to use them directly for de-mining. By making the damage and effects go through spell immunity, enemies will have to be more cautious even if they have a BKB.

Another idea would be to replace the toxic mines with lightning mines. When they are triggered, they zap enemies and stun them, then slows them greatly. This mine still does a significant amount of burst damage, but not enough to insta-kill. If the slow is high enough, then it can keep people in napalm fields for them to take more damage. So you can put pairs of napalm mines and lightning mines to cause great annoyance to enemies.

Sando hold your breath:

I actually like your idea! haha I agree that instakills break some dota rules. I think you could do even more to try to make him a support at first and not the weird roamer he is now, but I still like the idea.

You people are still thinking mines.....

Not radical enough for ka***ei.