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Opinions on unorthodox builds

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Forum » Theory Crafting » Opinions on unorthodox builds 40 posts - page 2 of 4

Poll Question:


Unorthodox builds, yes or no?
Yes
No
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by oldKainen » October 18, 2014 2:18pm | Report
jamesShajam wrote:

Lets compare with a Crystal Maiden.

You have an 80 damage 3x stun with 900 range on a 10 second cooldown
CM has a 3s, 210 damage semidisable with 500 range and 10s cooldown

You have a 1000 range 325 damage AoE nuke/blink/dodge on an 11s cooldown
Cm has a 700 range 250 damage AoE nuke on a 15s cooldown with a strong slow

You have thousands of HP
CM has a global mana regen

You have a global movement, carry-copying, chasing replicate
She has a channeled AoE

At level 25 she has 59 strength
At level 25 you have 69, plus whatever agility you want to morph in (all)


Maybe not a venomancer, shadow demon, or leshrac but pretty good no?


Morphling support is pretty gimmick, man. He has no armor or attack damage, and his mana pool is mediocre at best. His skills are made to burst enemies with magical damage and right clicks, as his potential is incomparable in both, going a support with him you just wasting a hero slot of your team. Morph STR is there to avoid excessive morphs of strength to agility - as excessive high HP with no armor means a very low EHP.

If you want to use someone with carry potential as a support, go with Sven, Slardar or an utility Mirana, as they have decent mobility and stuns.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Xyrus » October 18, 2014 4:12pm | Report
jamesShajam wrote:

Lets compare with a Crystal Maiden.

You have an 80 damage 3x stun with 900 range on a 10 second cooldown
CM has a 3s, 210 damage semidisable with 500 range and 10s cooldown

You have a 1000 range 325 damage AoE nuke/blink/dodge on an 11s cooldown
Cm has a 700 range 250 damage AoE nuke on a 15s cooldown with a strong slow

You have thousands of HP
CM has a global mana regen

You have a global movement, carry-copying, chasing replicate
She has a channeled AoE

At level 25 she has 59 strength
At level 25 you have 69, plus whatever agility you want to morph in (all)


Maybe not a venomancer, shadow demon, or leshrac but pretty good no?

No, not really...this is lvl25, what are you going to do at lvl1, lvl3, or lvl6? How are you going to gain levels? How are you effective without much Farm?

Try comparing with strong Supports:-

At lvl1 Skywrath Mage can Harrass pretty much any Offlaner out of Lane with Arcane Bolt, he can also pair said skill with another good Roamer's lockdown, e.g. Wraithfire Blast, Venemous Gale, Shackles, etc. and you can deal a lot of Damage in Ganks. At lvl3, you also have a Slow and a Silence. At lvl6, you have an insane amount of DPS from Mystic Flare + Arcane Seal. You can gain levels easily by Ganking, as your Mana Pool is large enough to use Arcane Bolt a few times without running out of Mana, and even if you do have to go back to the fountain, you've most likely Killed/driven someone from their Lane.

At lvl1, Sand King can Roam and Gank, there are better options for a "pure" Roamer, but with a good Roaming partner, he can be quite effective. Once he hits lvl3, he can Jungle quite easily for a fast Blink Dagger. At lvl6, he becomes a huge asset in Teamfights with Epicentre. He can combine Jungling with Ganking to gain his levels and while he needs a Blink Dagger to be make best use of Epicentre, he can Farm it without depriving the Cores.




Let's look at Morphling again. At lvl1 he has either Waveform, Adaptive Strike or Morph Strength + Morph Agility. Adaptive Strike is pretty useless at lvl1 since allit does at that point is deal 32 points of Damage and Stun for 0.25 seconds. Morph Strength will let you Tank up so you can...do what exactly? That only leaves Waveform, good for Chasing and Escaping, but Chasing with this at lvl1 is just asking to Feed. So at lvl1, your way of being effective as a Support is by running away better than any legitimate Support ever could.

At lvl3, if you take a point in all 3 Skills, you can now Stun for 0.75 seconds with Strength based Adaptive Strike. At this point, you're still useless at Ganking and certainly can't Farm the Jungle. Your only way of reaching this or any higher level is by sitting in Lane leeching Exp from a Core.

At lvl6, you can now send off an Illusion to Roam around the map, scouting and providing a place to relocate to. You have lvl1 Waveform and a 2.25 second Stun from Adaptive Strike. You're ready to Gank, but you're probably the lowest leveled Hero in this game by this point, since all you've done is leeched Exp from the Lane.

Even assuming you get to lvl25, yes you are quite Tanky, you have a 3 second Stun and you can move about quickly thanks to Waveform, but by this point...what is it that you do in Teamfights? Waveform in and Stun a Carry? then what? Sand King and Skywrath Mage can still deal a sizable amount of Damage with their Ults, Shadow Demon can still provide good Crowd Control, Wraith King can Initiate and Counter Initiate with constant Wraithfire Blasts and Reincarnation...




No matter how you look at it, Morphling brings nothing to the table as a Support...can't Gank, can't Teamfight, can't Jungle, can't save anyone except himself, can't Harrass, doesn't Scale well without Farm, etc.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Unscathed » October 18, 2014 5:08pm | Report
@Xyrus repped solely for the formattings :3
Don't Worry, Be Happy

Late credits to Janitsu for the sig

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Krwiozerca » October 19, 2014 2:14am | Report
Xyrus wrote:

No matter how you look at it, Morphling brings nothing to the table as a Support...can't Gank, can't Teamfight, can't Jungle, can't save anyone except himself, can't Harrass, doesn't Scale well without Farm, etc.


+Rep for explanation and effort. I think that was the answer that was needed in this thread.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Xyrus » October 19, 2014 3:11am | Report
Unscathed wrote:

@Xyrus repped solely for the formattings :3

Krwiozerca wrote:



+Rep for explanation and effort. I think that was the answer that was needed in this thread.

BOW BEFORE MY SUPERIOR FORMATTING AND LOGIC PUNY MORTALS!!!

(}8E

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Zerosaviour » October 19, 2014 4:19am | Report
Carry Sand King.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by KrDotoBestDoto » October 19, 2014 5:22am | Report
Sk mid singsing style?
Screw blink go straight abyssal mjolnir.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by JasChe_XXIV » October 19, 2014 5:28am | Report
Xyrus wrote:



BOW BEFORE MY SUPERIOR FORMATTING AND LOGIC PUNY MORTALS!!!

(}8E


And now sir mustache has gone completely out of control >_>


How about Carry Visage?
He's got the right-clicking capabilities due to Grave Chill and some items like Desolator
His Familiars can add that up with some right-clicks and stuns
He can last long in fights because of Gravekeeper's Cloak
Lastly, Soul Assumption can kill off the remaining survivors.
Disregard my noobiness on Visage, but this thread is all about unorthodox builds.
So yeah, there should be some noobiness present. :P
There's a fine line between bravery and stupidity, I have come to erase that fine line.


Care to check out my guide? Click on the picture below!


Still a bit wonky and nooby but meh, give me a challenge and I'll accept it!

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by TheSofa » October 19, 2014 7:49am | Report
You forget carry Vengeful. Actually happened in a pro game.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by UltraSuperHyper » November 22, 2014 8:16am | Report
TheSofa wrote:

You forget carry Vengeful. Actually happened in a pro game.


That's pretty common in pubs. Atleast b/w 2-3k mmr

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