Disabler, Escape, Initiator

I was going to write a long post explaining the reasons this is wrong...but it seems pretty pointless.

A carry hero requires some mix of the following attributes:

- Farming Speed
- Good stat increase in their base stat
- Good agility growth
- A passive skill that increases their damage scaling

DS has one of these. His agility growth is just awful, and he has no skills to help him deal damage - combined these make him one of the least suitable carry heroes in the game, along with CM and KOTL. Any half decent semi-carry or above with a BKB would make short work of Dagon DS - in fact he wouldn't be able to do anything in that situation except run away quickly. Hell, Lina is a better carry than him - better stat scaling, a useful passive and better farming speed.

Well Lina is a ganker while DS is usually offlaner, so...

I really thought that you had me here on the agility growth point until I looked up Doom's growth.

Dk has no damage scaling but he does have tank scaling, so whether damage or tank scaling, you have a point...

However, I do think that Dark seer's ultimate with algheims is scaling damage according to the damage of the opponent.

There is definitely no lack of a scaling factor there.

The 2 sorts of carry
1)Pure DPS - Faceless, AM, PA, Gyro etc (there are plenty more)
Agility/Int based carries. Will put out a lot of damage but are your typical glass cannons. They have some sort of ability that will scale into the late game like FV's passive stun.

2)Tank Carry - Alch, DK, SK, Lifestealer
These guys rely more on being about to outlast a team fight then anything else. They still put out a lot of damage but their biggest thing is not dying. If you can pin an antimage down, he's dead. Try doing that to a fully farmed Alch with less then 5 stuns.

As others have said, anytime you want, we'll customer lobby, either 1v1 in lane or better yet, just level straight to 25 and get 100k gold. You take your carry DS, I'll pick any actual carry in the game. Mid only. I can guarantee it'll be 2 kills and Ancient.

Oh, and back on topic, Naga can support. other then that your line up is too greedy. And doesn't really work well together. You don't have the burst to use bat rider, your void will be too hungry all game, SS and Puck both want a solo lane. With lockdown and stuns, you need burst damage to go with it.

Also WOOT! in before lock!

When I look at Kyfiods post on Doom, yes he doesn't have a good agi growth (same with tiny) but look at the whole thing, a COMBINATION of those. Doom has devour to increase his farm and a really high increase in str. Doom is also probably the best single target spell in the game or one of. Hes also rarelyt run as a hard carry. The problem with dark seer is he is completely nullified by a BKB and that his skillset is entirely utility based.

Thanks Ancient Hero - yes the point of the post is COMBINATION - Doom Bringer ticks 3 out of the 4 boxes (his damage scaling passive is supplied by eating an Alpha Wolf for +% damage and crits), DS ticks 1. This means Doom only has to compensate for his poor attack speed (usually with Assault Cuirass) and suddenly you have a pretty complete carry. DS needs to compensate for pretty much everything.

I.e. for Dark Seer to be a match for Doom, you'd need to find 0.5 stats per level, 30% bonus damage aura and 20% chance of 2x critical. And then you'd still need the Assault Cuirass to get enough attack speed. So you'd need to spend 1000s and 1000s more gold than Doom just be vaguely competitive with him - it makes no sense to do so.

It's true that Wall of Illusion does damage scale very nicely, but it's also a magic based ultimate with a long cooldown. It relies on:

- It being off cooldown
- The enemy walking or being Vacuumed through it with no magic immunity
- The enemy then hanging round to fight or being completely disabled

I.e - there's no way in hell you're going to kill an enemy carry outside a team fight, and even then you need your team to be providing physical damage and/or disable. I love DS, but he's a utility hero, not a carry.

Its Steel, not Skill you troll.

http://hydra-images.cursecdn.com/dota2.gamepedia.com/e/e5/DK_drag_lasthit_07.mp3

Wind runner

Ultimate suggests that she is a carry because she needs items with effects, none of her skills provide effects for her attack, nor a passive.

Her ultimate can be reduced from 60 to 15 seconds with scepter, and her physical damage increases per level.

This character requires carry items but has no carry supportive q w or e.

fricken sucks...

It's almost like the only hope for this character is Orchid

It almost seems like because of this characters design, there almost should be a general rule for any support, and that is... the first priority is to stay alive.... with defensive items?

Sure, wind run can get you moving fast, but it's not getting the benefit of going invisible.

With that said, it's almost like this character's priority should be to tank, even though she is a terrible tank... in order to take some hits after a stun and book it out of the battle with her E....

But to tank with wind runner? That just sounds contradictory... It's like this character needs an inventory of items that both provide defense/mana or life regen/mana... Like Ring of Aquila, Perseverance kind of stuff.... maybe even multiple drums of endurance.... but this would just to be able to survive until the last two slots could be occupied with monkey king bar and scepter...

Obviously hood of defiance and or vanguard would just seem stupid on her....

She is a semi support in most cases although the SEA teams like runnign her as a farmer in the agro trilane. She rarely shes action in mid though. And no, aghs is pretty ****ty on her...in a fight your not standing there autoattacking. Like DS, she is a utility hero. Getting a shackle on 2 heros is huge as it is a 3.75sec stun at level 4. She normally builds mek, forcestaff, orchid/sheep and such. Her Q is a supportive stun, it just needs some skill to hit and her W is a nuke like SS bolt. Multi drums isn't good either. After she gets her utility item be that an occhid or sheep then mkb is an ok choice. Wind Run is just an escape from autoattack or a positioning for shackle/powershot tool.