Drafting

Match ID: 650663332

Chen for early pushing and team fights. position = Jungle
silencer. semi carry (hitting power) and lock down of magnus and QOP. position = mid
witch doctor. team fight counter initiation and good early support for AM. position = safelane support
Elder titan. versatile core. team fight. position = solo off lane.
Anti-mage. Hard carry. Late game core. position = safe lane carry.

strategy/Bans:

Bans 1st: pushers and rats... i just dislike them.

pick 1st:
picked chen first since its a relatively weird pick for my MMR and he is a versatile hero, with pushing ability mixed in with some semi reliable ganking and team fight ability. plus he wouldnt XP drain since he would be solely jungle until AM trasition.

Witch doctor next. good lane support relatively cheap hero. semi good stun nice heal for lane sustain and good counter initiation with ulti.

2nd bans:

PL just to counter late game push and Team fight confusion. plus reduce support gold tax.
DK, wanted to ban out a durable strength carry with high armour whihc would have been a challenge with our strategy so banned out DK.

2nd picks:

picked elder titan since he is so versatile and can play mid, carry, offlane, support. this was one of our cores. we were planing to put him offlane but we kew they couldnt predict where we would lane him which helped.

silencer picked due to counter initiation to counter the magnus pick. also we needed a semi carry with some hitting power. plus as a mid if any of them go mid i would be able to starve them out.

3rd ban:
with the magnus pick just looked for any hero that would be nice to combo with him. decided a sand king would hurt alot and banned him out.

3rd pick.

anti mage due to our spread. late game carry and damage dealer. though about a faceless but decided agains't it.


thoughts lads?

went into this with a thought out strategy and ban list then altered the bans and picks slightly but kept the cores which we wanted. based it around a versatile spread of strategies.

strong late game hard carry. strong early game push. strong counter initiation. strong team fight. good XP earn spread. strong ganking.

Looks like your draft was alright, they had solid setup for somewhat of a wombo with Magnus+Qop+jakiro but obviously not the coordination to execute it, not did they really look like they had a true farming carry, unless Qop was 1 position for some reason.

Anti Mage is a solid pickup here simply because your team created space, and he looked like he just went ham on them, all those mana reliant heroes, the rest of your team was solid, I'm just not a big fan of the witdch doctor, I feel he's too greedy of a support to play 5 position. Silencer is a damn good pickup against that lineup, I'm still on the fence when it comes to a core silencer though, but it looks like it worked rather well. Global silence neuters all those spell reliant heroes rather well, gives anti mage free reign to just destroy them. Not too shabby. Elder Titan and WD have there pluses, but I feel there could've been better picks, considering how squishy that lineup is, a silence leading into a centaur ulti-stun+double edge, would've murdered their safe lane, and IMO is a better space creator for AM than Elder Titan.
Rubick would've had a field day against that lineup, all those abilities he could've turned against them, and he's much less greedy than WD.

I have to agree with this, WD needs a Blink for Positioning and landing dose Malefices, not to mention an Aghanim's Scepter to do any real Damage himself. He doesn't provide Reliable CC ( Paralyzing Cask is only decent for punishing n00bs, or myabe disengaging) and his Heal is too costly to be effective.

I see him as a good Dual Offlane / Aggressive Tri-Lane Core, go against their Supports, gets Kills and make their Supports cry from having their Intelligence Stolen. He has the same problem as Riki, if he doesn't start getting Kills and fast, he's just a walking Ult...

The Silencer pick was fine.

The problem with Witch Doctor is that he doesn't really provide much. Paralyzing Cask is good in the right situations but mostly it's just there to disrupt the coordination a bit. His W isn't exactly the best skill ever and Maledict is hard to utilize. He has a pretty good ult but it only deals damage.

He lacks the roaming/teamfight or the defensive counterinitiation capabilities that all good supports in the meta have.

hmmm ... i picked witch mostly due to his In-lane sustain with his heal and his counter initiation synergy with silencer with global silence allowing him to fully channel his ulti with out fear of getting stunned out, this happened 3 times when i was over the other side of the map ...

"smugg Ulti now!!"

next second...double kill.. 2 more seconds ...triple kill.

the reason why i picked him over AA and other hard supports is that they dont have the same synergy with silencer that other hard supports do... and honestly he is really cheap. all he needed is arcane's and maybe mek or drums and he was good to go in my line up.

reason for elder titan pick was that i wanted a really versatile core with 2 heroes that if need could swap up roles.

ive started to put in some fall back plans into my drafts now since ive had a few where a core hero didn't get the space and farm they needed and other heroes which werent core were ad couldn't utilize it.

silencer pick i think was perfect. in regards to the magnus mid ... he already was mana intensive and here he had no mana no last hits and no hp for the first 15 mins of the game.

the only pick i was worried about really was the chen. i dont know if that was right :/

As long as you have someone who can use Chen decently? Picking him is practically never wrong.

He can do 4-p-1 strats by creating space early, he can gank well, push well, serve well in teamfights and counter initiations - Chen is an absolutely great support. One of the most versatile, and certainly one of the best.

The only time you don't want Chen is when you want really strong laning, as you can't really pull that off reliably as a dual lane. If you're going aggro trilane, don't go Chen. If you don't have anyone who can Chen well, don't go Chen.

Otherwise he's almost always a great pick.

really Xyrus, just copy stuff from this thread and make a guide, otherwise someone else will the same question and you will have to type text blocks again

Well, even if I do make a Drafting guide, people will still ask questions and I'll still have to make Great Text Walls of China anyway. 8{D

Problem is: if you pick Chen you basically need to push early, because he falls off after ~20 min.
With AM as your carry you cannot push a lot, since he needs his free farm time to come online. Also you have no lockdown at all (except for Witch stun, which isn't really reliable and Chen creeps, who need setup).
You have no Tempo-controller, which is bad if you have a carry like AM, because without some tempo-controlling your enemies will just dictate the pacing of the game and probably kick your *** before AM can fight or just disrupt his farm.
Silencer is a nice idea, but you don't need more rightklick power, since you got AM. Puck would have been better for mid imho. With Puck you also would have had a really nice tempo-controlling hero.
Another possibility would have been Clockwerk instead of ET. You don't have heroes that synergize particulary well with ET and clock is another really good tempo-controller.
I think that Void would have actually been better for your lineup than AM. But overall i think you needed a carry that is better for pushing early than AM. ( Luna or Lycan maybe)

Bans: DK is a good ban, because he can push your base, before AM can fight. On the other hand, i don't think PL was a good ban in particular. With PL, AM would have had guaranteed freefarm, and a farmed AM is actually pretty good against PL. If you want to go for such a late game carry, you should focus on banning heroes that can go agressive very early and are able to push your base, before AM gets dangerous (like you did with DK; possible bans: Luna, Gyro, Lycan, Naix, etc)

http://dotabuff.com/matches/717671554

ok hows this one look?

my 3rd time playing magnus solo offlane so i fed a little but mostly because i would blink initiate rp then die but always got 3-5 man rp's so i think im getting better in that way. what should i build to survive more ? blademail ? or rush a heart?...

ok so if you want to see an awesome team fight look around the 30min mark, hid in the tree's near mid they pushed for tier 2 mid i got a 5 man rp skewered into tower range enigma black holed all 5 with a witch ulti and gyro ulti right on top ... team wipe.

it was glorious.

lanes were

offlane solo:magnus
mid:witch
jungle:enigma
safelane duel: gyro/dazzle

to be honest the dazzle won us this game. in lane he allowed gyro to survive long enough to do his damage and his positioning was next lvl.

questions:

what do you think of my bans?
what do you think of my pick placement?
item build ?
skill build?