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Forum » General Discussion » Dotafire plz. (chinese wall of text) 13 posts - page 2 of 2
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Fumbles16x » March 19, 2015 8:42pm | Report
I agree with pretty much everything you said in the OP Timm. I think this site, and most Dota 2 discussion forums as a whole, have a habit of jumping to the conclusion that a hero is OP just because their winrate jumps a bit.

Since I started playing Dota 2 a couple of years ago I have pretty much always held the opinion that nothing in the game is truly OP. There are times when a hero goes through a strong phase (after buffs, obvs) and times when others don't see much use. The game is one of the most balanced I've ever played, if not the MOST balanced. They do a good job of keeping heroes in check of each other I think, but sometimes a hero jumps into popularity for pros and it takes them a little while to figure out how to counter them. I also think that certain components (i.e. abilities and stat growth, etc) of heroes can be too strong, but almost never the heroes themselves.

For example, PPD did a few videos of himself analyzing drafts during the DAC finals and semifinals. When he banned Sniper he said himself that the hero is not that strong, they just weren't sure how to counter him yet so they would rather just not play against him at all. I think it's that way for a lot of picks that get really popular seemingly overnight.

But looking at individual heroes...

Storm Spirit - Very strong right now, yes. The only thing that is "OP" about him is his ult. There should be more restrictions on when and how he can use it. In most cases it's a free blink away as long as you have mana. Still, he isn't unstoppable. Lion, Doom, Shadow Shaman, Earthshaker... the list goes on. Just get lockdown. Buy Orchid. He's just a highly mobile hero who is countered by taking away his abilities, kind of like Weaver.

Axe - I personally haven't had any problems with this hero. His Berserker's Call shouldn't pierce BKB, but that's really all I can think of to change on him. That or reduce its cooldown.

Slark - I still think this hero is very strong. Essence Shift makes him carry too hard combined with his natural survivability, and he comes online really really fast. If given even a small opportunity, he just shuts down games.

Vengeful Spirit - Idk. OP? She's really strong but I mean.. I would rather go against her than a Lion. She transitions well into the late game for your hard carries due to her percentage based damage aura, but I really don't think she's too much to handle. Maybe a small nerf here and there.

Earthshaker - Yes, Fissure is too strong at lvl 1. Leave damage and mana cost, reduce range. It's stupid that you can smoke gank mid as creeps spawn and completely block a path home for a free kill. Make the length of the fissure increase with levels, it's just too strong early on. (Also maybe make creeps go around rocks again)

Shadow Fiend - He just gets a faster bottle now. Lvl 1 Raze is a bit better which means you can get a soul advantage earlier, but I don't feel like the hero has changed much otherwise.

Troll Warlord - I'm glad people finally recognize how strong this hero is. He can do so many other heroes jobs better and for less gold. I think that his ult needs to have a cooldown extension, because right now you can literally use it for two towers in a row in the same push. Combine this with a hero like Tiny (with aghs) and you can clear towers in about 5 seconds from full HP. Maybe make his ult not global? That never made sense to me. Make it the same radius as something like Drum so that heroes on the other side of the map don't get the benefits.

Idk, just my thoughts. I think the "OP" problem can largely be solved by counterpicking, especially in pubs. It's a rush to get the best heroes and people forget that they can just neutralize the ones they're playing against with a better draft.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Smuggels » March 19, 2015 11:12pm | Report
Dota is a game of such fine tuned balance even relatively small changes to small infinitesimal things has drastic effects in meta.

where you have true balance the weight of a feather can cause earthquakes"

we dont follow blindly the "pro" scene. but that is where we see how we can implement and use changes to the game.

all the heroes people call OP or Broken is because they have either had a huge change or a small change that allows them to be utilised in a new way.

no hero is OP

no hero is broken

all are equally powerful

how you play them is all that matters.

I WILL DESTROY YOU ALL.... WITH FLUFFY BUNNIES


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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Terathiel » March 20, 2015 5:41am | Report
I'm judging from my experiences, not pro tier, although I do take that into account.

The Bloodstone change + the buff to Storm's ball makes him ridiculously hard to deal with unless heavily counterpicked. The fact that EVERYONE, from 2k to 6k, is complaining about him suggests something.

Fitting the meta is a large part of a Hero's balance. You get Troll and SF who do this. I'm not particularly great on either of these guys, but my winrate with Troll is like 80%, and I often stomp hard with him. Which suggests that he's a bit too strong. If a Hero fits the meta so well he just wins, that's too strong and they need nerfs. I wouldn't call Troll hugely OP though, only slightly.
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