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I guess its my duty to do this.

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Forum » General Discussion » I guess its my duty to do this. 37 posts - page 2 of 4
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Atlas » August 12, 2013 8:55am | Report
First off, great game played by NaVi and Alliance. I don't see why you say "Alliance doesn't deserve it", NaVi is just as egotistic. They beat NaVi, both teams played well. The finals are over, there's no need to talk about who deserves what, Alliance beat NaVi fairly.

I was rooting for DK at the start, then once they were out I had really hoped Orange would be the losers bracket winners, that final game in Orange vs NaVi was just too crazy.

As for fountain hooking, yeah it's a game mechanic that's been in the game for a while. I can't say whether it's "OP" or not. On one hand, it instantly kills anyone with very little effort, and as we saw in Tong vs NaVi, it completely changed the course of the game because he could kill their carry with that simple combo. On the other hand, it's somewhat high risk. If you noticed all the shots that were missed, Dendi was put out of the fight until he TPd back into lane, and if he missed, well, that's 135 gold gone each time they miss a fountain hook. I think it could be "nerfed" in some way. Right now as it stands the mechanic is that if you hook, you get sent back, it'll still bring anyone back that it was going to hit. I feel like the hook should land first before they can be brought back to base. This would basically just make fountain hooking even harder to do, meaning you'd have to have precise timing, but it can still be rewarding, or just as penalizing if you miss it.

I feel Alliance was always the strongest team coming into the International, however, NaVi really does deserve some kind of special recognition for being the most consistent team. They have been in all 3 International Grand Finals, and won one of them. No other team has even been in the Grand Finals more than once, if only due to inconsistency of their gameplay/roster.

GG Alliance.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by manic_e » August 12, 2013 9:08am | Report
Hades4u wrote:

I don't see why the hate, they used the game mechanics in their advantage, if TongFu wasn't skilled enough to face it, why is it Na`Vi's fault?

Do you know football at all? Because I'm gonna use a football analogy. In 1986 England played Argentina in the world cup. Maradona one of the best players in the world used underhand tactics to get the win. Not by using his almost infinite skill but by getting away with using his hand to put the ball in the back of the net.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ccNkksrfls

The goal became known as the hand of god. I think Dendi's hooks in that match should also be known by the same name. The similarity being they both used a tactic which should not have been allowed, but was. I believe a number of pro's commented after that the tactic should not be allowed (Loda certainly did) and I wouldn't be surprised if it was removed in a future patch. I'm not even hating on Dendi or Na'Vi for doing it, I would have done the same in their position. The point is it should not be in the game. Na'Vi did not play well enough to win through playing fairly.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Hades4u » August 12, 2013 9:13am | Report
Once again. Game mechanics. Saying fountain hook is not good, that's like saying stacking neutrals is not good as well. It's just mechanics.
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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by manic_e » August 12, 2013 9:19am | Report
So is using your hand to score the winning goal, it's part of game mechanics, at least from Maradona's perspective.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oB-q_v_gGvY

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Ancient Hero » August 12, 2013 9:48am | Report
Its been a known mechanic for along time already, if valve or icefrog thought it shouldnt be there or was a bug, it would have been dealt with.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by xCO2 » August 12, 2013 10:34am | Report
Probably some of the dumbest things to be said about The International 3 out of Hades. Alliance did in fact deserve it more than any other team, in the entirety of the tournament they lost 3 matches and 0 sets. They are basically the reformed No Tidehunter, which a lot of people enjoyed watching, and contain a handful of very experienced and known players.

I came in the tournament a fan of Na'Vi but I can say that in the grand final I was definitely more supportive of Alliance. And not because of the Chen-Hook controversy, and believe me in the upcoming years it will still be a controversial thing that is brought up when referring to Na'Vi. At first I was a little distraught, and definitely thought it was a cheap exploit, still was a pleasure to see them turn it around even though clearly TongFu had the game by the balls. But in retrospect it was really going out on a limb to pull it off.

NB4: It is an exploit, Puppey even acknowledges it. Click HERE to found out why its justified.

To start off, I think most people overlook the strategy here, the hooks alone did not win the game, it was a delay tactic to give the Alche the space he needed, it also left Chen out of a spell and Pudge out of the fight. Its on TongFu for losing as well, they had a very clear advantage and instead of utilizing it, they took awhile to farm. Also, when Na'Vi took the fight to them Atlas made it very clear that Dooming anyone other than Alche would cost them the game and the teamfight to come had Doombringer use his doom on Pudge. I believe that had TongFu taken the fight and not played the cliche 'chinese' DoTA known as a farmfest then they would have taken the game unchallenged. If at all that the Meathook were to be the winning tactic, then I believe it would only be when they got the BKButter Gyro's Aegis and life.

I also just want to say I'm really glad that if anyone were to cast the game that Ayesee was the best choice by chance, he really gets the viewers pumped and I enjoyed listening to him.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by manic_e » August 12, 2013 10:36am | Report
Ancient Hero wrote:

Its been a known mechanic for along time already, if valve or icefrog thought it shouldnt be there or was a bug, it would have been dealt with.

If it's still in this time next year I'll be very surprised. I'm not basing that purely on just my opinion but those of other pro's and the the reaction from a lot of the community.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by mattyg2787 » August 12, 2013 3:21pm | Report
It's in the game therfore it's legit. Don't let dota become like bf/cod where certain items and combos are banned out by tournament organizers.

Go alliance!!!

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by xCO2 » August 12, 2013 9:38pm | Report
mattyg2787 wrote:

It's in the game therfore it's legit. Don't let dota become like bf/cod where certain items and combos are banned out by tournament organizers.

Go alliance!!!


By your logic Tinker's bots doing extra damage and all other bugs shouldn't be fixed because "they're in the game". Call of Duty and Battlefield aren't strategy based games, and Battlefield doesn't even have a competitive scene. The closest thing you can relate this to is Counter-Strike and that wouldn't even matter because what we're talking about is an exploit in the game that was incorrectly ported over.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by .lnk » August 12, 2013 11:22pm | Report
Really quick reply to Hades, IMO alliance deserved it just as much as Na'Vi, but one team played better than the other, dont see how they dont deserve it :/

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