Tidehunter, tank n' gank v0.5

Troll guide I think. Why ever take Kraken shell before level 9.

My guide isn't designed as a Carry guide, I'm sure their will be a ton of those on here soon enough. The idea is that (to me at least) Tide Hunter is designed to be played as a Soaker and Ganker (or initiator as per Dota character descriptions). I'm well aware of the damage scaling of both Gush and Anchor Smash, but with this guide, the primary effects (the Slow and Damage reduction) are the primary features of the build.

Again, I'm not trying to argue that he can be played in other ways, I'm just saying that's not the way I play him. Also, this guide is still in early stages. I appreciate the dialog happening here, and I'm testing some things before I update the item lists, etc.

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You're missing the part where the damage scales up too. I really recommend you try maxing Gush and Anchor smash together, you'll find Tide hits like a truck with that. The neg armour is more relevant when you consider your second nuke is 225 physical damage on a 4 second cool down at max level.

That's the other thing Anchor smash isn't a flat skill either, max it out and the AOE damage triples and the cooldown is pretty much halved.

It's kinda like saying the stun on lina's Light Strike Array is a flat amount, so I won't bother leveling it. Tidehunter has a pretty large nuke potential early/mid game. If you don't max your nukes you're looking at 435 damage a spellburst, and more than half of that is attached to your high CD ultimate. On the other hand if you max Gush and Smash you have a 735 spellburst, and 225 of that is a 400 AOE on a 4 second CD, did I mention it's only 60 mana?

I recommend looking into Tidehunter less as a "tank" (the accuracy and usefulness of the class in Dota can be debated at length) and as an early game DPS caster along the lines of Lina. See what you get out of it.

Thanks everyone for the feedback.

I agree with Vanguard being a bit of a waste, depending of course when you get it, and the other teams make up. As I stated before this is a very early draft, and I'm new to DotA itself, plus I've only been in the beta for around a week. The only items that are set for me are the early/mid "core" build. Both starting, and late game are still a work in progress.

Tanking is technically a D&D term. It's also referred to as a soak. Basically any character designed to come in, CC of some kind (taunt, slow, etc), and soak a load of damage. Initiator is a type of ability, and is too vague of a description of a character.

@Loveless, as I explained, I think leveling Gush first is a waste since the armor reduction isn't the real important part of the ability. The slow is flat across all levels, which is the initiation portion of the ability anyways.

That is kinda they point, you need no items on him ;).

Buy some wards and be happy.

Good luxury item would be Pipe, blink dagger and maybe The frosty armor thingy.

I don't play him, but from what i have been seeing, it seems like the way to go.

So you are saying refresher orb and uh... well agha's doesn't work on him. So refresher orb is all you need, correct? Thing is, you need to survive before and after you land you ultimate, as well as do some damage. Vanguards is going to prevent a lot of damage, as well has give you a nice HP boost with some regen. It's a great item to use on him, late game it's a bit of a waste though.

Tank oriented out from MMO's Like everquest and world of warcraft btw.

btw, thing is with tide, you are bassicly a walking ultimate late game, your sole purpose is to land that ultimate, and vanaguard is kinda a waste there...

I've seen tank used for a while in dota. Whether it be named something else, the definition remains the same. Damage sponge, beefy, tank, it's all the same. And like I said, initiator is an important role, but it's nothing more than a sub-role. If all they have to offer to a team is the ability to start the fight, that's not much of a role. Initiators always have something else to offer to a team. Take Cryx, for example, he offers quite a large amount of damage after he initiates. Lion offers plenty of CC as well as a high damage ultimate. VS has something to displace an enemy, a debuff and a stun. They all have a greater notch to fit than just "initiator".

Also, I always get vanguard on Tide. It's really good for him if you are going with a tank/tanky build. That block is a lifesaver, really.

Backwards, tank would be a sub-role and it was always referred to as Survivability. Initiators are in just about every game, though not as much in the highest level of game play because it really comes down to everyone pounding it out all at once without a seconds warning. Ward watching, ward hunting, ward smoking, find enemies, have a 3 second 5v5 and take half a lane.

Also, Gush would be more important than Kraken Shell. What you are really aiming for is the duration and having every extra armor reduction helps in the game. Enemies can go into the negative after all, that is why there are team compositions out there that focus on armor reduction and can really do some serious damage early into the late.

Anyways, -1 because you are still one of the stereotypes when it comes to Tidehunter for getting Vanguard.

Anyways, Tank did not originate from DOTA. I can absolutely guarantee it didn't, but that doesn't mean it originated from LOL either. It didn't come into constant use for this genre until LOL.

+1

Also I don't know if you have Dota 2 yet, but most of the heroes have their listed roles and TH is listed as a tank.

There is a reason Naix is called an anti-tank. Because there are Tanks. An initiator is a sub-role if anything. If their only purpose is to cc one person and start the fight they are not doing much for the team. If they are initiating, peeling enemies off carries, offering utility, supporting the team with wards and auras on top of soaking most of the damage in a teamfight, now THAT is a role. That role is called tank.

List of tanks: Tiny, Centaur, Axe, Slardar, Tide, numerous others.