Help Support Our Growing Community

DOTAFire is a community that lives to help every Dota 2 player take their game to the next level by having open access to all our tools and resources. Please consider supporting us by whitelisting us in your ad blocker!

Want to support DOTAFire with an ad-free experience? You can support us ad-free for less than $1 a month!

Go Ad-Free
Smitefire logo

Join the leading DOTA 2 community.
Create and share Hero Guides and Builds.

Create an MFN Account






Or

7 Votes

Guide to Snowballing Alchemist

June 14, 2015 by Diadochi
Comments: 12    |    Views: 80754    |   


Quick Comment

You need to log in before commenting.

[-] Collapse All Comments

Sort Comments By
1
[-]
Sp3ctr3 (4) | February 2, 2016 2:43pm
Hi, nice guide, very informative. Just some things.
1- Isn´t Blink Dagger a good item for Alch? I almost always build Blink so I can close gaps fast and blink+stun is a really nice combo.
2- I love Assault Cuirass, I just love it, of course everyone builds the items they see fit, but the armor reduction is great with your Acid Spray and it also gives +armor to you and your allies and increases your AS.
3- Mjollnir it's a great item, I agree with you. The increased AS and the active are awesome and it increases your farm speed a lot.
4- What about Eye of Skadi, I prefer this item over Heart of Tarrasque.

Great guide, I'll give you a +1
1
[-]
aystro | February 2, 2016 4:28am
A front strength hero like Alchemist cannot be played without blademail. Unless you have a designated hard tank in team. Which you usually don't have.
1
[-]
strider | June 15, 2015 8:35pm
BF is decent,sure regen is kinda wasted but you get it for cleave,you should consider it when supports are stacking a lot and you have ton of space,in pubs and most of time even in competitive you won't get that luxury.
1
[-]
Blubbles (13) | June 15, 2015 7:51pm
Wall of text, it could use some formatting, but good guide.
1
[-]
Diadochi (2) | June 15, 2015 7:34pm
^Thanks. Yes, I also hate BF on alch. I felt like I couldn't be too harsh about it as Ditya.Ra on PR owned with it against alliance and in the video I linked its what wagamama built. I'm assuming its because of Ditya.Ra that everyone's building it now as I used to barely ever see it but now everyone is going for it
1
[-]
fires.of.hell (2) | June 15, 2015 12:39pm
I think Battlefury is a horrible item for Alchemist. The reasons why they get Battlefury was the HP/MP regen and cleave which Maelstrom and Chemical Rage can compensate. Good guide btw.
1
[-]
Diadochi (2) | June 15, 2015 10:16am
@sando, yea that's actually a very good point that I read from an alch trend today. Someone said that he goes from just maelstrom straight to AC to give him more durability, whih is intersting and I'll give it a try. About the aghs bit I tried to steer people away from getting it too early unless it would make a large impact as if you spend 20 farming just to die too fast it's a waste of farm.

@hamstermater- first of all, definately won't take it personal, and thanks for your input, especially in correcting me that concoction is physical. But, I do have to disagree about other heroes doing Te same thing better. Alch shoul be gettin +36g/creep once he has mjolnir which is just massive and hat separates him from other heroes that you've listed. Just the other day I played a game where a spec had tried to out farm and had built a Midas and radiance and at 30 mins he wrote that my farm was crazy as it had just over 300 last hits while he had only 130, and I was getting more for every last hit then him. When it comes to having space created for farming no1 does as well as alch and this allows him to come online earlier than other heroes who may be "better" carries but who wot have the time to get there. When I play alch I often end up gettin the first rax at just over 30 mins as I have a bkb and so can take high ground.

Yea, maxing GG is the bit everyone gets grumpy about lol. If ou are really struggling in lane you will need concoction or acid up earlier. I possible I max at 7 because this means that you are getting 36 extra gold/creep at level 7, which is huge. The longer you put it off te slower your farming speed is when you have maelstrom.

I hope that perhaps I have convinced you a little that picked correctly and played well alch can be a great carry. This is the way I play him in pubs and even without supports stacking for me I have just under a 60% win rate in the new patch and that is even with people picking jungle dependant heroes as well as people like the OD I played with today who took the first rune from me. My friends I play with encourage me to play alch as they tack for me and know that before 20 mins I will be making a large impact. Wagamama and artery have videos up of him in the current patch where they annihilate as him and PR used him well also which I think indicates that when picked correctly and played well alch certainly brings somethig unique to the game.

Sorry for the spiel ;) lol I'd just low to see my favourite hero played well by more people
1
[-]
T3xo (1) | June 15, 2015 9:59am
Well i just won with this build..
30min farm and ended game.
Went phase>maelstorm>basher>mjolnir>ac>helm of dominator>mkb.
1
[-]
Hamstertamer (89) | June 15, 2015 9:06am
Okay, so, the guide is well-written and informative.
Yes, farming with an early Maelstrom is IMO the only way to play the hero that makes sense. So good for that.

However, I disagree with some of the things said here.

- Unstable Concoction is purely physical damage (look at the wiki). It gets amplified by Acid Spray.

- The skill build. Going to be honest...maxing Greevil's Greed first is just not viable in pubs. With this skill build, you're literally a melee creep until you hit ~level 9. How are you going to win your lane? You're assuming that you have competent supports to do that for you? That's kind of assuming a lot, isn't it? And it's just not happening. One value point in Greevil's Greed and maxing Acid Spray if you need lane control (e.g against a strong offlaner or a dual lane) or maxing Unstable Concoction if you need kill potential (when laning with aggressive supports) is WAY WAY better.
Honestly, with this skill build, the enemy offlaner is going to have a blast murdering your supports and your lane will be lost.

- Going safe lane. See, the problem with Alch is that you just can't carry with this hero, that's why he was considered trash in 6.83. The repeated nerfs that he received make him an easily kited carry with a very bad steroid and no HP, and his stun nerf means that there's no reliable way for him to stun without getting disabled and stunning himself.
With this build you're assuming that you gets tons of babysitting that allows you to freefarm your lane...to get what is a essentially a pretty weak carry.
That's the reason why the hero has such a bad winrate. Anything he does as a safe lane carry...other heroes do it way way better. Sven farms pretty fast, snowballs just as well and carries way harder with far more DPS. Gyrocopter... Tiny...same.

And in 6.84...he's still just as bad as a carry. The only difference is that now he can give Aghanim's Scepters¸ to his team. So this is the reason why people who play him play him as a utility hero not as a main carry.

Don't take anything I said personally since it's not directed at your guide, but more at the hero. Alchemist was literally unplayable in 6.83...he was the worst hero in the game. Now Icefrog in his generosity gave him a way to give free Aghs to his whole team, a buff that would be OP as hell is it was applied to any decent hero. So now the question remains of how to use his Aghs-giving feature (the only decent part about the hero) in the right lineup and without Alch himself being too useless.
Essentially...don't try to carry pubs with Alch, because you just won't. And even if you do that's because the enemy team is terrible and a Sven/Tiny/Gyro/whatever would have done this job far better anyways. Alch is a semi-carry at most...who can gank, farm and give Aghs. Leave the safe lane to a *good* carry and try to fit in the offlane by maxing spray or something.
And then, maybe, MAYBE you can reach 55-60% winrate with this hero by sometimes being useful and not throw too hard just by picking him :)
1
[-]
Sando (118) | June 15, 2015 7:46am
Alchemist already has great attack speed from his ult, so Phase Boots do more damage, and also make you harder to kite.

Overall I like this guide, you've hit on some good discussion points and also talked about when not to pick him, which is frequently missed. I'm a little concerned how vulnerable you're running Alchy here - no extra HP or armour items at all, kinda risky when your stat gain is so bad. Still, it could work well if you get left alone to farm. You kinda need to change the title here - snowballing refers to killing heroes, not farming the jungle!

Most interesting point with Alchy these days is what to do with his scepter passing upgrade...as you say, do you put the farm on him, or do you pass it around? A lot of other heroes want those Aghs upgrades sooner rather than later...but does that leave you weak?
Loading Comments...
Load More Comments
Similar Guides
Featured Heroes

Quick Comment (14) View Comments

You need to log in before commenting.

DOTAFire is the place to find the perfect build guide to take your game to the next level. Learn how to play a new hero, or fine tune your favorite DotA hero’s build and strategy.

Copyright © 2019 DOTAFire | All Rights Reserved