New Alchemist build.

So,
lately we've been seeing a lot of alchemist radiance manta octacore.
I tested this build various times like this game (wich is normal skill but the concept is applied even in vhs... i guess?) http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1894302622

I ended up getting butterfly just to fountain camp them.

OK so what i was wondering is why do we get this build? Alch doesn't have any natural way of spawning illusions and might as well farm a battlefury instead to open the possibility of farming ancients and a better lategame scaling. Also, the battlefury has sinergy with alchemist's q, a thing wich isn't present in the radiance build...

Also the battlefury might open up a "antimage" build instead of the "naga" build where you get a blink instead of a manta style, wich also sinergyzes with alche's stun.

Basically what i don't get is why you go radiance and not battlefury... The damage is the same, splitpush is a bit less but you have more scaling and sinergy.

So is this good, or at least situational? ty for constructive answers :)


BTW, i finally got to 4k mmr xddd <3333

Because right now, Alchemist is a Naga Siren that comes online 20 minutes earlier.

I still think BFury into AC + Heart is the best build, but the Naga Siren build is having so much success that you should try and abuse it while you can.


By the numbers, the naga build is undboutedly a gajillion times better. Not questioning.

Excuse me, try and abuse what? Whatever by some miracle may work in those pro games, in pubs such an Alchemist in your team is usually an instant -25 pts. Thank Gaben such "abusers" are almost always in the enemy team so I can pick Lina(or basically any semi-decent mid hero because Acid Spray doesn't secure **** in mid lane) and just destroy him in lane with 0 cs.

I don't know how this works in pro-scene( Naga Siren is at least hard to shut down thanks to ult), but please don't pick this hero into this build in ranked matchmaking. I personally developed a rule of reporting Alchemist in my team if we lose, regardless of his performance, this hero is just so useless.

Alch's winrate in competitive is nothing impressive right now. Just look it up, it's 52%. Nothing even close to the big stompers in this patch like Doom or Tiny, or the good old imba supports like Dazzle.

Just because you go for Naga's build doesn't make you Naga. Mirror Image is what makes Naga what she is (and the only justification for an octarine build on her). Otherwise I'm going to go blink-diffusal-manta on sand king and say I'm anti-mage xD

Diffusal wont work on SK, isn't caustic finale an orb effect.


Guess you still wont be an antimage. You are a fake. A copy cat. Pretty much what alch is right now.

AFAIK diffusal isn't an orb effect any more.

The Alchemist build seems so weird, like I really don't understand it. I can maybe see Radiance being good, since you can get it really early, and alchemist wants to be in the middle of the fight all the time, but I'm just very confused about everything else.

oh. true that.
1 is orb and 1 was orb.

And I feel the same way about this idiot naga build on alch. Somehow I cannot see the synergy.

Why is the naga build so good on alchemist? Alchemist can farm radiance extremely fast which accelerates his farm in comparison to other heroes by a large margin. Since he also has Greevil's Greed his farm is even more ridiculous in comparison. How do you increase that even more? Make illusions to farm multiple places at once with radiance. The synergy is solely based on Greevil's Greed and maximizing it's potential.

So why not a traditional BF build? BF is slower for farming, because Alchemist has no build in mobility or constant sustain and the range of radiance allows farming multiple camps at the same time while not losing much HP. This leaves his ultimate up for actual fighting and does not have to be used to farm which causes alchemist to have a high farming rate while maintaining good survivability. Ganking alchemist also becomes harder due to radiance miss chance and damage output early being so high and availability of the ultimate.

Radiance basically allows nonstop farming and non-reliance on the ultimate for fast farming.

Synergy is the same as with naga's Q and Radiance, only you get more money because of the passive. So you get Radi, Manta and Octarine, and then you get even more gold and then you lose because you are 3 vs 5 against the enemy 30 mins into the game. Grz with ez -25, go next.